We Support Conan!
-
TRO will always be with you, Consy.
I know it is weighing heavily on the minds of each and every TRO reader (in which case I mean, hi mom!) as to where we stand in the current battle for Tonight Show supremacy. So, we’d like to announce that we here at The Restraining Order would like to officially come out with our support for Tonight Show host Conan O’Brien in the 2010 Late Night host imbroglio.
It’s not just that each of us have grown up nurtured by Coco and his timeless comedy acumen. It’s not only because Conan’s humor has shaped our own deeply that we find ourselves on the side of Team Conan. No, besides the fact that Conan is an institution of laughs who is worthy of so much more than the stupidity that NBC is currently shoveling his way, we firmly stand united in the Cone Zone as much as we rebel against the evils that is Jay Leno.
How did we get to where we are today? Apparently, a tiny, shitty website like this one is the only one that remembers the actual facts of how this all went down. Seeing as how we’ve been reading reports of how NBC is letting Jay Leno down and how we have even seen the sweaty, grotesque Leno supporters belch a revised version of history that makes our skin crawl, we feel it is our duty to set the record straight.
Exhibit a.
Jay Walking
Source, Entertainment Weekly. Sep 27, 2004:”In 2009, I’ll be 59 years-old and will have had this dream job for 17 years,” Leno said in a statement. ”When I signed my new contract, I felt that the timing was right to plan for my successor, and there is no one more qualified than Conan. Plus, I promised [my wife] Mavis I would take her out for dinner before I turned 60.’”
Jay Leno decides with his last contract that he will retire from his post at the Tonight Show and pass the mantle to Conan O’Brien. Unlike what you’ve read from Leno supporters, he was not forced. He was not canceled. He was not beaten up by NBC goons while he signed away his late night birth rite to Conan while Conan cackled in the distance. Unlike Jay Leno in 1992, Conan was selected on a 5 year plan to have a clear succession per Leno’s admitted desire to step down.
Exhibit b.
Leno May Switch to Fox
Source, Newsmax.com March 4, 2007:According to the New York Post, the “Tonight Show” host is unhappy about NBC’s plans to replace him with Conan O’Brien in 2009. But Leno’s unhappiness may mean smiles all around Fox.
Clearly, between 2004 and 2007, Jay Leno had a change of heart. Either the cost of buying thousands of shitty muscle cars was more than he thought it would be, or the idea of actually taking his wife Mavis to dinner was so unnerving that Jay Leno decided to use his ratings clout and Tonight Show seat to openly lobby other networks for a show. NBC was put on notice. Deal with Jay Leno because he wasn’t going to actually retire like he said, or else. He had made his intentions known.
Exhibit c.
Jay Leno Hints At ABC Future
Source, Huffington Post. July 15, 2008:“…on Monday’s “Tonight Show,” Jay Leno hinted at a possible future with ABC while reading the popular segment, “Headlines.”
Leno held up a TVWeek cover that said “The Tonight Show with Jay Leno…starring Jay Leno on ABC.” Then, Leno joked, “It’s like a headline from the future!”
Less than a year before being ousted from the Tonight Show, per his arraignments, the stakes are raised. Of course, Leno knew full well NBC wouldn’t let him go. He had dug his claws in far too well with his over 20 years of conniving. Jay Leno might be an unfunny, humorless, watered down prick of a man, but no one has ever claimed he doesn’t know how to play the game. If he didn’t, David Letterman wouldn’t be at CBS right now.
The rest is well known. NBC caved to Leno on the fear he’d take his huge chin and even larger stable of Hollywood guests that he’d sucked up to for years with him to a rival network. Instead of Leno knighting Conan with his black book for Hollywood’s elite, the same one Leno stole from Johnny Carson, Leno was going to take it to another network where the stars were soon to follow as they’d grown comfortable with Leno’s coddling of them, throwing them softballs, all these years.
Enter The Jay Leno Show.
NBC was terrified and so they cooked up a plan to allow themselves their chin-shaped cake, and eat it too. They decided to save some money, cut five scripted shows a week, and gave the hour to Jay Leno to pay his ransom. Everyone knew it was a terrible mistake. For the fourth place network, it was the death knell. By November 2009, less than 6 months after it debuted, the Jay Leno Show had ratings worse than two CW series. NBC, which used to air ER in Jay Leno’s time slot, was getting beat by the CW.
Of course, the real loser in all of this was the NBC affiliates. Some were never on board with this plan from the beginning. Others felt “only the egos of NBC executives are keeping Leno on the air.” No one was sticking around to watch The Jay Leno show, much less the Late Local News, which is the bread and butter for local stations across the country. Jay Leno, and NBC’s lack of a backbone, was destroying local TV stations.
In addition, without vaunted ratings winners like ER and Law and Order, shows which Jay Leno enjoyed as a lead in when he was hosting the Tonight Show, the Conan O’Brien lead Tonight Show was suffering as well. At this point, as the Jay Leno Show was circling the drains and affiliates were threatening to take matters into their own hands and just not air the show, Leno revealed his ultimate ploy, his desire to retain the Tonight Show and kick Conan to the curb. On November 2nd, 2009, he planted the seeds of deceit and asked for the Tonight Show back.
Jay Leno opened up in a new interview about the survival of his new 10 p.m. talk show, saying that he would have rather have stayed in his 11:35 timeslot, and that he’d go back to the “Tonight” show if asked.
Broadcasting and Cable interviewed the TV icon about the show, and critics who say that his show isn’t garnering high ratings.
About whether he would return to “The Tonight Show,” which is now helmed by Conan O’Brien, Leno said, “If it were offered to me, would I take it? If that’s what they wanted to do, sure. That would be fine if they wanted to.”
“Would I have preferred to stay at 11:30? Yeah, sure…”And here we are, only two months later, and Leno is getting his wish. NBC finally, mercifully, declared the Jay Leno Show a failure, and set aside everyone’s ego to do what’s best for the affiliates and the network, one year too late. Their plan however, wasn’t to make Leno own up to his promise to retire, manly because they gave Leno an iron-clad two year contract that they can’t eat, by offering the collective heads of the NBC late night shows a plan in which Jay Leno would open after the late local news with a 30 minute show at 11:35, bumping Conan’s Tonight Show to 12:05, and Jimmy Fallon’s Late Night to 1:05. Somewhere Carson Daly is sobbing at the lack of anyone caring about his impending unemployment.
NBC clearly needs to get out of the Jay Leno business. Instead of trying to work past their mistake in letting Jay Leno renege on his decision to retire five years prior, they decided to tarnish the legacy of The Tonight Show by bumping it to the next day, screw Conan O’Brien by making him NBC’s late night second fiddle, completely ruin any shot Jimmy Fallon had to build an audience, and putting Carson Daly on suicide watch (admittedly, a happy side effect of abject failure on NBC’s part).
It’s not hard to see why, therefore, that we support Mr. Conan O’Brien. As much as he’s done to make the world laugh, Jay Leno and NBC have done as much to give the world AIDs. We’re onto you, Jay Leno. We will not rest. We will not stop. We will not brush our teeth until you are out on the street begging strangers for chin jobs for nickels where you belong. And NBC, once you cancel 30 Rock, we’re done with you. Never again will be abused by you. Where we once thought, just because you hit us, you still loved us, we now know for certain that if we don’t go stay at our sister’s house that you’ll kill us once and for all if we don’t get you a beer.
Better know your enemy.
For those of you still uncertain, having read this scornful tome, allow me to demonstrate exactly why Jay Leno is evil:
- Jay Leno’s chin is abnormally large due to it holding a pocket of Yellowcake uranium that he sells to Iraqis.
- As expensive cars are desired by men of middle age to compensate for their less than adequate endowment in the wang area, therefore, Jay Leno’s ownership of several hundred such cars means his penis is actually inverted. Gross!
- Jay Leno fucks spiders.
- Jay Leno, slaver owner. Evidence? Kevin Eubanks.
- Jay Leno once raped your mother.
- Jay Leno’s wife Mavis is actually an orangutan. This is why all attempts to bear Jay Leno’s fruit have been genetically unsuccessful so far.
- Jay Leno designed Teddy Ruxpin.
- In 2 girls 1 cup, it was Jay Leno’s cup. He gave it to them.
- They don’t call committing genocide “Pulling a Leno” for nothing!
- Jay Douglas Leno or LAND USA OGLE JOY? That’s right. I’m onto you.
- Jay Leno put Bella in the wych elm.
Rise up, yon brothers of comedy! Rise up, and become one against NBC and Jay Leno tyrannic imposition!
I think we all know what needs to be done.
Leave a Comment
-116x116.jpg)
Add Our RSS Feed to Your Reader!
January 14, 2010 at 12:51 am
Did you know that he also killed Michael Jackson?
January 15, 2010 at 9:27 am
That motherfucker left Bubbles homeless!?
January 16, 2010 at 5:04 am
i’m a fan of Conan, but this article was really shitty. Long story short, I just want to applaud you Apoplectic Fittz for the Trailer Park Boys reference. That was easily the best thing about the article.
January 16, 2010 at 5:05 am
Anything for a fan.
January 21, 2010 at 1:48 am
@Tender Vittles
the bubbles reference was to Michael Jackson’s monkey bubbles as per the post that he killed Jackson…not Bubbles from trailer park boys…I like where your head’s at though.
January 14, 2010 at 8:39 am
I’m going to gas Jay Fucking Leno and round everyone that sides with him into concentration camps.
January 15, 2010 at 9:41 am
Wouldn’t it just be easier to carpet bomb him?
January 14, 2010 at 7:34 pm
Awesome post, guys! I support Onan too! He’s my favorite biblical character.
January 15, 2010 at 9:42 am
Mine is whichever one has the balls to end Jay Leno.
January 16, 2010 at 2:31 am
The biggest a-holes in all of this are Jeff Zucker and “Dick” Ebersol, executives of NBC. Legendary assholes that should be strung up by the rafters of Conan’s studio.
January 16, 2010 at 4:50 am
Zucker, Fallon, Ebersol, Kevin Smith, and Leno are on notice.
January 16, 2010 at 3:32 pm
second
January 20, 2010 at 5:01 am
I couldn’t agree more! It’s always the executives/management’s fault. Afterall, they are the ones who has the final decision. All these conniving and incompetence CEO’s should be strung up to the highest pole for everyone to see for ruining an establishment with so much history. Let’s start with NBC, GM, AIG,etc., etc.,
January 16, 2010 at 2:57 am
I now bow down to your previously unviewed by me website. You are The Man of websites.
How can people not see through Leno’s BS? Chin blocking the view?
Long Live Conan. Doesn’t anyone think of the sacrifice he made moving his family to Cali, with that skin? Geez.
84 million BITCH! Pay up NBC!
January 16, 2010 at 4:51 am
You’re right. Conan risked skin cancer for this network and what does he have to show for it except for betrayal?!
Shameful, NBC. Shameful.
January 19, 2010 at 4:28 pm
Soon to be $40+ million. That’s not too bad in my book.
January 20, 2010 at 2:54 am
I wonder if you polled Americans and asked them if they could have their absolute dream job wherein they’d make many, many millions, or $40 million up front to do what they pleased. What would the majority answer?
It would be interesting to see the results. Myself? I’d absolutely choose my dream job.
January 19, 2010 at 2:44 pm
I’m with you, girl.
He’s been waiting patiently for Leno’s departure, and then gets screwed.
The $32 mill compensation hardly pays for the move from Beverly Hills to LA EX.
I’m glad Conan’s taking pot shots at NBC. When you were “fired” unexpectedly, didn’t you wish you could sock it to your ex boss for the next 10 months? He’s just doing what we all wish we could!
January 16, 2010 at 4:00 am
I am so fucking done with Leno. He just committed career suicide. Once upon a time, I thought he was a nice guy. TEAM COCO!!
January 16, 2010 at 4:52 am
This might be the silver lining in this whole mess. I’ve known the evils of Jay Leno for decades now. He’s been able to evade everyone for the last 17 years but now everyone sees him for what he is.
Satan.
January 27, 2010 at 4:42 am
Yeah it’s called the internet. Leno still reads newspaper headlines sent in by his fan base aka the old folks. He probably just barely heard of it and doesn’t even know how to work it. I need to point out one thing; Americans in general have a short memory, ex: some are blaming the current administration for the shit show that we call the economy right now, and they are getting away with it. Let’s keep this fire burning guys. I’m with Coco.
January 16, 2010 at 6:26 am
Brilliant…
January 16, 2010 at 7:32 am
None of the press is reporting anything about how Jay already stole the Tonight Show from David Letterman (as well as him hiding in closets to listen in on conversations). With Conan, this means he’s twice stolen it. And not only did Conan relocate, but his crew did as well. These are hard working people who left NY with him that will now be jobless. Leno should be ashamed of himself. But then again, he’s too much of a egoist to think he did anything wrong. Or is that a sociopath?
January 16, 2010 at 7:37 am
Leno is absolutely a top villain for what he did to Letterman, as well. Leno’s got about 20 years of being a Grade A Prick behind him.
I think one look at his mug would tell you your answer. He’s clearly a sociopath.
January 16, 2010 at 9:03 am
All for Conan here, but your timeline is not correct. Leno made these statements after NBC had renegotiated Conans contract and given him the Tonight Show. Leno, a loyal employee, did not want to look like a jerk. So he went along with the idea and cast the story as retirement rather than the truth, which is NBC did not want to lose Conan so they were firing Jay.
January 16, 2010 at 9:20 am
That’s simply not true, my friend. Read the links within the post. The time-line is completely as it happened.
Besides my opinions, which are greatly exaggerated and clearly polluted with vitriol, the actual dates of the events are as they happened. That’s not conjecture on my part.
Conan was NEVER given the Tonight Show until Leno, Conan, and NBC worked out a succession plan. All of this transpired based on Leno’s desire to retire from the Tonight Show.
And listen, if Leno really didn’t want to step down, why wouldn’t he say something in 2004. That’s when he could have made sure this bullshit didn’t happen. Leno’s not worried about not looking like a jerk. He clearly looks like one now, as he did back in 1992, as well.
The issue is, Leno got cold feet somewhere between 2004-2007 as I pointed out and worked and plotted to get the show back that he decided, arbitrarily, was his. And now, we see, he’s willing to destroy anyone in his path that he feels is in his way.
And before you buy into the “aw shucks” Leno as a victim of NBC as well, just know, Leno is a hypocrite as well as a monster.
Don’t believe me?
Check this out from a quote in The New York Times in 1992 before the Letterman/Leno battle for The Tonight Show was settled:
“I am disappointed,” Mr. Leno said. “I feel like a guy who has bought a car from somebody, painted it, fixed it up and made it look nice and then the guy comes back and says he promised to sell the car to his brother-in-law.” Go Elsewhere? ‘Of Course’
Mr. Leno said he would “obviously leave NBC immediately” if the network decided to give the “Tonight” show to Mr. Letterman. He said he would absolutely refuse to do a show in the 12:30 A.M. spot now occupied by Mr. Letterman’s show, “Late Night,” and would indeed consider creating the same problem for NBC that Mr. Letterman’s proposed deal with CBS caused.
“Would I go to CBS if they asked me?” Mr. Leno said. “Of course. I’m not going to do some little happy hour from Omaha at 12:30.”
http://www.nytimes.com/1992/12/23/arts/jay-leno-criticizes-nbc-on-tonight-cliffhanger.html?pagewanted=1
Sound familiar? Sounds like Leno was worried about the Tonight Show getting taken away from him before he could leave his mark. NBC is as much of a bad guy in this as Leno, but make no mistake about it, Leno is a bad guy, too.
January 19, 2010 at 4:32 pm
Thank you…For saying it right. NBC fired Leno, because they didn’t want to lose Conan, but then they didn’t want to release Leno to another network, so they made up the Jay Leno Show.
Both the Jay Leno show and The Tonight Show with Conan were failing, so now they’re back-tracking. Again, you based your whole biased argument on something, that really isn’t relevant. Way to go, Jake!
January 20, 2010 at 9:39 am
Everyone can say what they will about this whole circus
but the one thing that’s being overlooked here is that the The Tonight w/ Conan sucked. This last week (?) has clearly been his best the whole time he has had the show.
January 21, 2010 at 1:06 am
I disagree with you. Millions of others do as well.
January 16, 2010 at 9:58 am
Btw, that’s Johnny Carson’s Tonght Show that Jay is claiming to “painted, fixed up and made to look nice.” jay’s agent at thetime took a lot of the het for that deal. And he let her. Bt she has sinced passed away andnow we see he was the culprit.
January 16, 2010 at 10:06 am
Here’s hoping Jay Leno will be next in line to kick the bucket.
January 16, 2010 at 3:29 pm
dropped my jaw on that one. YOU R NOT A WELL PERSON.
January 16, 2010 at 9:27 pm
I’ve never admitted that I was one.
Neither is Leno.
Perhaps he and I should duel.
January 18, 2010 at 6:47 am
You sir are a saint! I would love to see a duel. In fact I would love to see someone throw an egg at Leno during his first new show, but then the security @ NBC studios would certainly throw that person out of the lot and possible call the police, but dam it would be worth it. If I wasn’t on the other side of the country I would launch some eggs at that big chinned douche bag. I used to think Leno was ok, not funny but ok, somewhat rude to his guests at times. Now I see the truth. Leno fuck you!
January 22, 2010 at 11:56 am
Hmmm. I wouldn’t want to drive all the way to California to egg Leno, but … you’ve planted an idea in my mind.
Use a railgun to accelerate a carefully padded capsule filled with eggs into orbit, calculated precisely on a ballistic flightpath that ends over Jay’s house.
At the last moment, a parachute opens, slowing the capsule, and the bay door opens dropping a thousand rotten eggs on Casa Leno !
January 16, 2010 at 10:11 am
Great article!
Supporting your viewpoint, here is Variety’s Flashback:
How Variety Covered 2004’s Leno/O’Brien Transition Announcement:
http://weblogs.variety.com/on_the_air/2010/01/flashback-how-variety-covered-2004s-lenoobrien-transition-announcement.html
January 19, 2010 at 12:16 am
It’s amazing to me how public opinion can change once the facts of a story has faded from memory.
If we could go back to 2004 from what we know now, I think people would be shocked at what Jay Leno and NBC is pulling here.
January 19, 2010 at 2:50 pm
Yes, people have amnesia!!
I say Leno owns the mafia. That’s why the NBC producers are scared –itless!!
January 16, 2010 at 12:02 pm
Jay Leno picked Sarah Palin.
January 16, 2010 at 9:27 pm
Jay Leno = Brett Favre.
January 16, 2010 at 12:52 pm
I have two questions, someone please answer them:
1) How did Leno “steal” the Tonight Show from Letterman? Leno was Carson’s PERMANENT guest host. The network and audience clearly liked him. Why didn’t he deserve the job?
2) Conan’s Tonight Show was not doing well in the ratings. If Leno bows out, like some are suggesting he should, what ON EARTH makes anyone think that Conan would be allowed to keep his version of the Tonight Show?
And so what if he changed his mind about retiring. People change their minds all the time. Doesn’t make someone a monster. THIS MESS IS ALL NBC’s fault, not Leno’s.
January 16, 2010 at 2:08 pm
Leno clearly has shown he has motive.. a selfish motive.
Anyways, Leno had poor ratings at first too.
You’re only allowed a chance if you’re Leno, best I can tell.
January 16, 2010 at 9:33 pm
1) Johnny Carson himself wanted Letterman to have his seat. Now, I know it isn’t his decision, but if you can’t honor the wishes of Johnny Carson, then damn, that’s cold. Letterman couldn’t be Carson’s guest host because he was too busy revolutionizing the platform on his own show, the show he was doing to be groomed to take over the Tonight Show. Oops. Thanks NBC.
2) Conan’s ratings are similar to Jay Leno’s when Leno took over for Carson. It’s been 7 months, man. You don’t build an audience in 7 months. In late night, that’s impossible. And look at the lead in Conan has. He’s got the Jay Leno Show. A show that’s getting beat by CW reruns. Jay Leno had ER, perhaps the highest rated show EVER. It’s a different game and the deck has been stacked against Conan…thanks to Leno.
Also, this isn’t about “picking on Leno.” It’s about exposing him for the lying, conniving, greedy hypocrite that he is. It’s time for America to remove the “Nice Guy” title from Jay Leno that NBC has been force feeding us for too long.
January 19, 2010 at 4:46 pm
Didn’t answer the last question…So what if he “changed his mind”?
January 20, 2010 at 3:02 am
So what if he changed his mind? He had a contract and went on his show and said “Conan, it’s yours.” That’s what. Yes, even in showbiz, that should mean something. If your word is shit, you’re shit.
If the words coming out of Jay Leno’s mouth mean that little, that him reneging on the agreement he made with NBC and publicly endorsed on the Tonight Show, I don’t know how I could be any more correct in my convictions that the man isn’t honorable in the least.
January 27, 2010 at 5:29 am
It was pointed out on the internet somewhere that when Johnny Carson retired he left, last time I checked that is what one does when they retire. Leno so obviously could not stand to let the fuck go and so he retaliated.
Mr. Fittz, I heard the most interesting take on the toolbag that is Jay Leno from Rosie O. on the Howard Stern show, more evidence for your case and how deeply disturbed Leno really is, believe it or not your dirt is just the surface, Leno planned all of this. pathological sociopath.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ2fZH2XqNw
If the link doesnt work go to youtube and type rosie o donnell slams jay leno
January 18, 2010 at 10:37 am
Letterman was Carson’s pick to take over the show.
January 16, 2010 at 1:08 pm
Great read my friend. Hey, maybe you can find the answer to this…Didn’t Conan turn down an offer from FOX in 2004 that would have paid him 3 times what he was making at NBC? Damn, Conan has integrity!
January 19, 2010 at 3:05 am
Conan was indeed being courted by other networks but he waited patiently for Leno to retire to have the shot at taking over what’s considered the pinnacle of late night television. That’s how the 2004 succession plan began.
There is nothing that compares to The Tonight Show. That’s what Conan worked toward his entire working life. NBC is taking it away after seven months.
Awful.
January 16, 2010 at 2:18 pm
I think the demonizing of Jay or Conan. Regardless of whether Leno chose to retire willingly or was just notigied that he would be replace at the end of the the contract… Leno has the same right we all do…to not retire.
Leno was becoming a free agent and now had the ability to negotiate with another network.
It was NBC who was afraid to let Leno compete against them and they did something really stupid. They acted out of desperation and signed Leno to a huge deal for a 10PM show.
When the 10PM show failed NBC was stuck with two large guaranteed contracts. Since they were unwilling to admit their mistake and eat the huge Leno contract or Conan’s big contract. Their is certainly no reason that either Jay or Conan should just walk away without their guaranteed money.
NBC came up with the stupid idea for both shows to be in late night with the Tonight Show moved later.
All of the the current controversy is NBC’s fault.
Had they simply let Leno walk at the end of his contract, this mess would not exist.
If they had simply approached Leno and paid him to go away, Conan would be happy and Leno would be laughing all the way to the bank.
This was a mess entirely of NBC’s making.
I truly believe the decision to pay off Conan instead of Leno was not based on talent or future success.
I simply think they would have had to pay Leno more by eating his contract.
Ultimately this is stupid and short sighted. Leno and Letterman are both reaching an age where their appeal to younger audiences will go downhill.
Conan will go to another network and compete with them head to head. Within 5 years Conan will be the king of late night.
As for integrity… if Conan actually turned down an offer from Fox for 3 times his salary, that is not integrity.
If one enters into a contract and fulfills the terms of that contract, he is under no moral, ethical or legal obligation to enter into a new one.
If Conan turned down a Fox contract, it was simply because of his hopes for one day being the Tonight Show host… and was likely told by NBC that it was his eventual future.
January 16, 2010 at 9:35 pm
You don’t do one thing, say one things, and then renege. That’s the complete opposite of the definition of integrity. Like you said, regardless of the truth in Leno’s succession plan, Leno honored it then and then went back on his word. That’s deplorable.
Leno has made a long career of getting what he wants, no matter the price for anyone else. Leno deserves nothing by scathing criticism.
January 19, 2010 at 12:03 am
The guys at NBC bounce from crisis to crisis always certain they were wrong about every decsion they just made. It must be hell to function like that. Their bosses at GE/Universal/Comcast need to fire the whole insecure bunch and get some actual level headed leadership in there.
January 19, 2010 at 12:18 am
Best case scenario is Comcast bails on their purchase of NBC and everyone gets canned…then tarred and feathered in a public forum.
January 16, 2010 at 2:30 pm
Why would you replace the #one late night host. It does not make any sense.
January 16, 2010 at 9:43 pm
You don’t. NBC didn’t. Leno’s not going to live forever. He decided to retire and chose his successor in Conan O’Brien. Then, somewhere in between 2004 and 2007, he changed his mind. Now Conan, his staff, and their families are blowing in the wind based on the whims of Jay Leno.
And honestly, if it’s a business decision, if it’s about the money as everyone is saying, if it’s about getting Jay Leno back on the Tonight Show because he was #1, NBC is in for a rude awakening. Conan is beating Leno in late night ratings RIGHT NOW. That’s never happened!
After this debacle, Leno’s going to be hard pressed to get his audience back. There’s going to be transition. And maybe, just maybe, if Leno gets his ratings to a respectable level, by then, he’ll be ready to retire again. He’s not too far off the age Carson was when he retired.
So, why not opt for continuity, NBC? What’s going to happen in 5 years from now when Leno retires for real? The Tonight Show is going to constantly be in flux. What are they going to do? Promote Jimmy Fallon? If NBC wants Jimmy Fallon, they’ve already got him. His name is Conan O’Brien. Only Conan O’Brien had a money earning future at NBC, now I have my doubts for anyone that replaces Leno.
It just doesn’t make sense on any level other than the one that you apparently don’t mess with Jay Leno when he wants something because he’ll ruin the lives of anyone to get it.
January 16, 2010 at 3:25 pm
I’ve always been a LETTERMAN watcher, unless Jay had someone on that I REALLY liked, i.e., Springsteen…. So, all this is here-nor-there for me, BUT for gosh sake Mr LENO and whoever your bosses, zucker, etc., are…. Conan is getting low ratings ’cause Jay WOULDN’T leave, and they put his show on JUST before the news. Basically, competing w/Conan. I think Jay has dug a REALLY BIG hole and he won’t get anywhere near the ratings he’s had in the past. TOO MANY PEOPLE think this is ALL JAY’S FAULT!
January 16, 2010 at 9:49 pm
It’s not all Leno’s fault, that’s easy to concede…well, easy for someone that isn’t blood thirst for Jay Leno like myself.
Clearly NBC is #1a to Jay Leno’s #1b in terms of blame for this disastrous dicktardery. That said, anyone that knows the history of all of these “Late Night Wars” knows that Leno has his ways of getting what he wants at any means necessary. Probably including sorcery and Satanism.
History will look back favorably on the anti-Leno crowd! The veil has been lifted!
January 20, 2010 at 3:16 am
I often watched Jay since the 90’s. I was happy when he took over the TS. But several years later…Aaagghhh. I’m not thrilled with Letterman, but will watch depending on his guests. I’ve watched Conan since he had his show in NY and was excited that he took over TS. I was happier about being able to watch O’Brien at a better time. I like O’Brien. I really like his comedy. So I can’t understand (I’ve read your blog, but really, why?) NBC would put him back the TS knowing his past ratings. I don’t think he’s Satan, but I really think he’s black mailing some exec(s). Just a thought?! There should be NO reason why he must be on NBC unless there’s something he knows about ’someone (NBC EXECUTIVE)’ and is using it to do whatever he wants. They should change NBC to JLBC. And the black mail theory would make a good John Grisham book don’t ya’ think?
January 20, 2010 at 3:32 am
I think at this point, this story is so large, it kind of has to be developed into a tell-all book/movie.
You’re right though. I’ve heard every reason as to why Jay Leno is getting the Tonight Show back. I’ve dissected every point Jay Leno and NBC has tried to make as to why they believe it’s a good idea, and yet, not a single one of them make any sense.
Not a single one. It’s almost like they’re doing it just to do it at this point. As if their egos are so large that changing course and admitting a mistake is less important to them than fixing their network. It’s truly baffling.
January 16, 2010 at 6:24 pm
I have known Jay Leno was evil ever since he was giving out VD on Good Times.
January 16, 2010 at 9:45 pm
Hilarious!
I recognized his ascension to pure terror right around the time he was hawking Doritos.
January 17, 2010 at 5:45 pm
Jay Leno: “Suck all you want, I’ll make more.”
January 16, 2010 at 9:06 pm
I think Leno is a nice guy with principles and acumen, if not just a little predictable and behind the times in terms of humor. Letterman is pretty much his antithesis – a-moral and mildly amusing. I say we sweep noth networks and just institute Craig Ferguson as the late night Tzar.
January 16, 2010 at 9:51 pm
Only if Conan gets to be Comedy Chief of Staff and Leno gets to be dead.
January 19, 2010 at 2:52 pm
NO WAY!! COLBERT NATION rules!! and he’s a friend of conan’s so I say Youthful comedians RULE!!
January 16, 2010 at 10:53 pm
Leno’s 10:00 show sucks and is a ratings disaster. So much so that the local affiliates go bananas and demand NBC do something because his lead in is killing the 11:00 news ratings. Now the affiliates low 11:00 news ratings are providing a poor lead in to Conan’s show. It all goes back to Jay. How does he get off playing the victim here?
PS: Dick Ebersol can burn in hell.
January 16, 2010 at 11:14 pm
If anything, we can now clearly pinpoint the villains in this comedy of errors. Ebersol has always been a massive prick, now we just know he’d probably murder your grandma if he knew he could make a buck off of the deed. That’s, if nothing else, helpful in publicly undressing them in all of their future endeavors.
The fact that NBC is playing the smoke screen PR game for Leno with quotes like…
“On Friday, Jeff Gaspin, chairman of NBC Universal Television Entertainment, had said the crossfire between hosts “has definitely crossed the line.
“Jay is the consummate professional and one of the hardest-working people in television,” Gaspin said. “It’s a shame that he’s being pulled into this.”
…just shows me that NBC and Leno has been cooking up this dog and pony show for a long while. It’s rather convenient to me that all of this is going down right as the late night schedule is going on hiatus for the Winter Olympics. That gives Leno just enough time to get himself a set, crew, and production all settled into his newly minted Tonight Show. Without it, this move to oust Conan within weeks wouldn’t have been possible.
Zucker, Ebersol, and Leno.
All of the above at NBC are scumbags.
January 18, 2010 at 6:57 am
You sir are correct, I agree with you 100%, this is something those douchebags @ NBC have had up their sleave. I thought the exact same thing when I read that comment from d-bag Gaspin.
I have been a fan of conans for many years and I was so excited when he got the tonight show finally! This is a bunch of BS. I have emailed my local NBC affiliate (Atlanta) as well as affiliates in LA, Boston, NY, DallasFt.Worth, Miami, San Francisco, and Washington DC basically telling them I will never watch an episode of the tonight show with jay leno and I am going to boycott their entire network because of what they have done to Conan and to us formerly loyal viewers.
NBC and Leno can suck a fat pole and burn in hell!
January 16, 2010 at 11:25 pm
Conan is only slightly funnier than Jay, which is to say not very. And to think the dude needs more time – give me a break. He’s only been on late night TV for sixteen years and they told him 5 years ago he’d be moving up. How much time does he need? Late night is not the same as the local news in terms of a lead-in. People may not care which newscast they watch, but they will change channels for a talk show host on late night television. Letterman is much better than either of them. The real mistake was in not going with Carson’s advice and giving the spot to Dave. NBC blows, Jay blows, and Conan blows slightly less.
January 17, 2010 at 12:56 am
Jay had it just as bad as Conan does right now in the ratings, until the whole Hugh Grant thing.
January 17, 2010 at 1:16 pm
I’m with you AF, Leno came to my college in the late 80’s (when he was just a stand-up) and was an absolute A**hole. He treated all of the students who planned his event with disdain, rudeness and behaved as if he were a god unto them. I observed his behavior and have never liked him since. You just can’t behave towards others the way he does and get away with it. Others in the business have known about his megalomaniac egotism. Some say he changed, but I have not observed this to be true. He is an unapologetic man with no scruples whatsoever.
January 17, 2010 at 6:32 pm
Amen!
My mother and grandmother saw him preform at a casino in Shreveport, LA and said he was arrogant, unfunny, pissy, and dismissive of his paying audience for not laughing at his shitty jokes.
He’s a monster.
January 17, 2010 at 6:06 pm
Here’s what I don’t get. A couple of weeks ago, when this whole mess came to light, some people started saying Leno should “bow out” and not accept the offer of taking his old Tonight Show back. (So that Conan could stay). But Conan’s ratings sucked. Why would anyone think that he would be allowed to stay if Jay REALLY retired? Conan would have been CANNED ANYWAY. NBC just wants the good, heck #1, ratings it had with Leno, back….That’s showbiz!
January 17, 2010 at 6:29 pm
Conan wasn’t going to be canned. You’re insane. He’s been on the show for seven months. NBC wasn’t going to can a Tonight Show host they bread for the show for 15 years in seven months. Don’t kid yourself. Don’t delude yourself so that you can make Jay Leno’s betrayal feel like something you can live with.
This wasn’t even about Conan O’Brien. Don’t make that mistake. Conan’s Tonight Show isn’t what forced NBC’s hand here. This was about Jay Leno. Specifically, in this case, the Jay Leno Show. Affiliates were about the boycott the Jay Leno Show on at 10 PM because it was ruining their ratings for their late local news (not to mention Conan’s ratings).
NBC had to do something about Leno now or there was going to be anarchy amongst their affiliates. Local studios were losing money because of NBC and Jay Leno.
The fact that they’d consider even keeping Leno after HIS show failed is what is so baffling to everyone. If they’d have just admitted they had made a mistake with their experiment of a talk show in prime time, no one would have batted an eye. Most people expected it to fail miserably!
And if Jay Leno had just admitted it didn’t work and retired like he said he wanted to do in 2004, no one would have blamed him or thought poorly of him. NBC, instead, got butt hurt about the thought of having to admit a mistake.
Instead, Leno started his power play to get a show he promised to someone else back because he apparently doesn’t have enough money or hasn’t ruined the careers of enough innovative comedians that he knows are funnier than he is.
Keeping Leno is all about NBC and Leno’s ego.
And since you’re apparently unclear on how these things work, it takes a hell of a lot longer than seven months to establish a late night audience. Jay Leno had similar ratings to Conan when he took over for Carson in 1992, and that’s before cable was really a factor.
And guess what, if Leno gets the Tonight Show back, the ratings are going to be in the toilet. No one in the business is supporting Leno. except for NBC execs, and they’re being laughed at by everyone else.
So Leno’s ratings are going to be terrible and NBC will be left with what? Jimmy Fallon to host the Tonight Show?
Good luck will all of that.
Also, you’re questioning if Leno really was going to retire? Really? You doubt that? I guess all of NBC’s running interference for Jay Leno has affected your perception of reality. Here, why don’t you watch this video:
http://tv.gawker.com/5450086/jay-lenos-shocking-2004-indian-giving-promise-to-conan-obrien
Tell me that isn’t coming out of the mouth of a liar now?
January 19, 2010 at 12:18 am
All this crap about the local news is a bit too convenient for NBC. The show was bad. The ratings were bad. NBC had to cancel it…instead of just shaking it off and going on with their 50 year winner, these idiots continued the corporate death spiral with the idea of the 2 shows. O’Brien is the only one thinking clearly here when he stopped them from destroying the “Tonight Show” by moving it to tomorrow. He should run the damn network.
January 18, 2010 at 10:41 am
No, Conan would not have been “canned anyway.” It took Leno years to be able to get high ratings on the Tonight Show, and Conan has only had 6 months. Conan is not doing any worse than Leno did upon beginning to host the Tonight show. He hasn’t been given a chance.
January 18, 2010 at 5:31 am
Dick Ebersol had Norm MacDonald fired from SNL for telling too many jokes about O.J. Simpson, Ebersol’s good buddy and former employee at at NBC Sports.
January 18, 2010 at 5:42 am
that’s the worst thing ever.
January 19, 2010 at 12:19 am
I completely forgot about this travesty!!
Oh god, Ebersol is a monster.
January 18, 2010 at 10:41 am
Jay didn’t steal anything. the NBC execs made the decision, Leno over Letterman. Conan bombed . Any other TV show, that had a ratings plunge like Conan, would have been pulled in a month.
If Jay has so much “pull” at NBC, how come, even though he always beat Letterman , in the ratings. NBC paid him less than CBS paid Letterman.
With his “power”, he should have stormed into NBC execs, and demanded more money than Dave. He’s just an employee of NBC. He doesn’t make decisions. It’s THEIR MONEY, not Jay’s
January 18, 2010 at 10:43 am
Conan did not “bomb.” By that definition, Leno bombed the first several years that he had the Tonight Show. And Conan has only had a few months.
January 19, 2010 at 12:17 am
So, Jay didn’t say he was going to retire?
That was all made up voodoo hocus pocus, then?
Oh, I get it. NBC “made” Jay retire. Because Jay’s camp says so.
January 19, 2010 at 12:26 am
Go on, continue burying your head in the sand.
I can’t help you to realize that you’re a marionette for NBC if you’re going to believe things like “Jay…always beat Letterman, in the ratings.” or “(Leno’s) just an employee of NBC.”
What you should do is READ THE POST and the comments and open your mind to thoughts that might not be comfortable for you to take. Sometimes, however, the truth hurts.
January 18, 2010 at 11:09 am
Since the phrase “Indian giver” is dated and un-PC, can we start working to get “Leno giver” off the ground as a replacement?
January 19, 2010 at 12:18 am
Yes, though, it may be too harsh of an insult. “You god damned Leno.” “Dang, man, I’m sorry!”
January 19, 2010 at 12:30 am
I’m going to start using Leno’s name in any reference of evil. An example:
“He looked into the eyes of the beast. He stared it down. He was unwavering as Satan pierced into his soul with the devastation of a Leno.”
January 18, 2010 at 12:34 pm
Correction for everyone – NBC did not admit that the 10 o’clock version was a failure. They claim it did everything they expected it to do (i.e. suck in the ratings but save/make them money). It’s the affiliates who picked up the torches and pitchforks…they forced the issue since they were losing money hand over fist. Conan suffered the same “lead-in” ratings problems but was performing as expected for their infancy – yet NBC execs claim that he’s the failure. Somehow it’s all Conan’s fault all of a sudden? Only one’s buying that are the Leno fans (and just a note to NBC – those fans are shrinking – literally, dying off every day…) Corporate heads need to roll to save this network from implosion. No longer is there any concern about (quality) entertainment for it’s public; it’s only about money, nothing more, nothing less. Zucker, Gaspin and Ebersol should all be publicly exposed then purged. Even so, Leno is in this deep, no doubt…
January 19, 2010 at 12:19 am
Frankly, I’m done with the network. Soon every show I like on there will be canceled anyway, I’m sure. Especially 30 Rock. You can tell they’re kind of winding down
January 19, 2010 at 12:32 am
As sad as it seems, I wouldn’t be surprised if NBC doesn’t exist in a not-too-distant future in a way we would recognize it now. NBC always seemed like the most venerable of the Networks and now it’s practically a homeless man’s toilet.
January 18, 2010 at 1:12 pm
I can resolve all of this for you wonderful people in just two words. It is that simple:
Chelsea Handler!
January 19, 2010 at 12:33 am
Yes, if you include two more words: “…is hanged.”
January 18, 2010 at 3:26 pm
The problem with Team Coco members like you is that you have to be virulently anti-Leno. So much so that you miss some very obvious points.
Leno sucked in 1993 because he was building his show from the ground up. All he had done up to that point was guest host for Carson every now and then. He didn’t really have his own staff, cast of characters or whatnot.
Conan had 17 years of a 12:35AM talk show to hone his skills. And he had 5 years to prepare for the move to 11:35PM. All he had to do was adjust his formula for 11:35PM and keep the bulk of the 5.2M viewers. Instead he largely kept the same forumula and lost nearly 50% of the viewers.
The fact is Leno’s show got canned and NBCU had a problem. Do they let the king of late night (Leno @ 5.2M viewers @ 11:35PM) jump to another network? That would make NBC the 4th place network at 11:35PM (behind Leno, Letterman and Nightline). Or do they try and keep the #1 (Leno) and #3 (Conan) late night shows?
They went for the latter, Conan wouldn’t play along so NBCU decided to cut their losses. Better to “settle” with the #1 rated late night show, than end up with the 4th.
Yes, NBCU screwed Conan. Yes it’s Leno’s fault for not performing at 10PM. But Conan is also at fault for not doing his job and bringing in the numbers he should have.
January 18, 2010 at 11:04 pm
Yep. Call the waaahmbulance. If I have to hear Conan say “we have an excellent show tonight” one more time I’ll scream. It’s like OCD or something, much like the general content of this blog. To be fair, Conan actually looked and sounded like a mature late night host for the last few shows. Adversity makes one grow up pretty quickly. And he has the nicest suits, hands down. But he’s very nervous (after 15 years), and that makes the audience nervous too. Even though Jay sucks on occasion (and which one of these guys doesn’t, Jimmy Kimmel?), let’s move on, get conan a real job on FOX so he can directly compete, and let the fur fly.
January 19, 2010 at 3:13 am
“Jay sucks on occasion?” Okay. So, it isn’t a matter of actually enlightening yourself to the facts of the situation that is unfolding right now, your problem is you just lack taste.
That’s unfortunate. What’s it like being you?
January 19, 2010 at 12:21 am
No matter how good you may or may not be, everyone needs a lead in. It’s TV fact. Conan didn’t have it. He was doomed from the start. He could only keep the fans he already had, and not get new ones, a lot of whom are tech savy and younger, whom watch stuff on things such as Hulu and NBC.com, which do not count in the ratings.
January 20, 2010 at 3:40 am
True. There’s no business like show business. Jay had lost a lot of viewers. Like me for instance. He just wasn’t funny or captivating as he once was. I stopped watching. But O’Brien steps in and well, I followed. I know a couple of others that didn’t do it right away, but people talk and word spreads. More people start watching. I’m just one with only seven months to spread the word. I strongly believe that he would have made the ratings in a couple of years. I’m not a huge NBC fan. They have a history of canning my favorite shows. So, once 30 Rock and/or Heroes gets cancelled I’m out of there.
January 20, 2010 at 5:38 am
NBC clearly just doesn’t want to evolve and are fighting tooth and nail to avoid it at even the cost of looking moronic to everyone from the most well informed insiders to the passing observer. New media is eating into their profit margins and instead of embracing it, evolving their model with it, they’re resisting it or flat out ignoring it.
This whole catastrophe is just a microcosm of NBC’s irrational resistance to change. The old guard is being ushered back in at the cost of innovation that is desperately needed.
January 19, 2010 at 12:36 am
Good thing Conan had several years to gather an audience plus the highest rated prime time shows in history like Jay Leno did. Oh wait? You’re telling me he didn’t? Only seven months you say?
Yeah, that sounds like the same scenario.
January 18, 2010 at 3:45 pm
There is only one thing that I can agree with in this article. This IS a shitty website.
January 19, 2010 at 12:22 am
Clever, aren’t you?
January 19, 2010 at 12:37 am
You’re right. What does that have to do with Jay Leno being a scourge to be razed?
January 18, 2010 at 9:57 pm
These people that hate Jay are actually hilarious! According to your logic, Jay is responsible for everything that’s ever gone wrong in the universe. Bottom line, Conan didn’t/couldn’t perform. He’s had years to get ready, and for some reason he chose not to. So now he can go to Fox, where I’m sure he’ll maintain the same small, rabid audience he’s had for all these years. Leno will get his normal ratings back. It’s delusional to think that Hollywood supports Conan! Take a pill and get over it, people!
January 18, 2010 at 10:53 pm
I mainly blame NBC but you’re naive to think that Leno didn’t have anything to do with the current situation. Conan is the funnier host hands down. The fact is, Conan has worse lead in than Leno did. So, in turn, Conan gets less viewers because less viewers are tuning in to the 10:00PM time slot and the 11:00PM news. Conan was never given a fair shot at The Tonight Show because of the execs at NBC and Leno. I will NEVER watch Leno again because of this. This IS the Letterman/Leno feud all over again, and Leno is going to win AGAIN! Well here’s hoping his return to the Tonight Show tanks.
January 19, 2010 at 12:55 am
I have to guess that Conan realized the first betrayal by NBC was letting Jay stay on (more or less intact) after he supposedly stepped aside. Thats why he was nervous. He knew NBC was keeping his replacement act all warmed up right outside the studio door. What a sucko place to work that must be.
January 18, 2010 at 11:25 pm
you need to take a pill, beach.
how the hell can you say that conan didn’t get ready after hosting late night for all those years.
jay should have been the one who got ready..for retirement. If his sorry ass had gone off into the sunset of retirement like he should have then none of this would have happened. THe network would be cancelling whatever sorry ass 10pm show they had on instead of playing shuffle with the hosts.
Anyway I hope Conan goes to Fox and goes head to head with Leno and slays him. Enjoy leno while you can missy, he is an old fart whose time has passed and he will be gone soon too, like a fart in the wind, haha!
hell no, jay must go! down with evileno!
I admit its not ALL jays fault but if he retired then this would not be happening right now, would it? dont try to blame conan, don’t be a hater, beach!
January 19, 2010 at 12:15 am
“Jay is responsible for everything that’s ever gone wrong in the universe”
You are correct Ms. Merlin, beginning with giving Eve the fruit. He should crawl like the snake he is.
January 19, 2010 at 12:23 am
Leno did some backhanded stuff. I guess that’s okay to ignore, right?
Also, what about lead ins? I mean, are you just assuming good things get ratings, and that’s that?
Sorry pal, doesn’t work that way, and never has.
January 19, 2010 at 12:40 am
Yes. You’re right. This is exactly what is said in the article and corresponding comments. You’re reading comprehension is astounding and beyond reproach.
If fact, you’re so good at reading what has been written here, I’d suggest you do it again, and run laps around the rest of us once more!
January 18, 2010 at 10:43 pm
Are Jay Fucking Leno and Lane Fucking Kiffin somehow related? Traitors? Think only of #1?
January 19, 2010 at 12:41 am
Goodness, you’re right. Lane Kiffin is totally a Jay Leno starter kit.
Frightening!
January 18, 2010 at 11:02 pm
I’ve read your fine article and all of the (mostly fine) comments. I’d like to add my piece, in the form of a video recorded at 4:00 a.m. after a night on the town, called “Leno, O’Brien, & the Peaceful Transfer of Power”:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fi1Adx_Hy6U
January 19, 2010 at 12:46 am
This was awesome. You’re a fine young man and a soldier I’m glad to have on my side in this encroaching battle.
I’m glad to see that it matters to you. It should. It should matter.
January 18, 2010 at 11:21 pm
Bottom line,”Leno ain’t funny!”
January 19, 2010 at 12:53 am
That’s pretty much the most offensive part of all of this, yes.
He’s a terrible comedian being given the throne to comedy.
January 18, 2010 at 11:29 pm
Just watched Leno and sure enough he is playing the victim. He’s saying NBC came and told him in 2004 that they had his replacement and that he was all like, why? we’re #1, why would you want to ruin that? And NBC says well, you won’t be number one forever, we have done studies and we know our audience. So he “agrees” to take a prime time show.
I can’t see NBC changing their mind or second guessing themselves at the risk of causing all this trouble. It’s more likely to be that Leno changed his mind about retiring as Carson did and just go away with class…and NBC knows things will be much worse if Leno goes to another network head-to-head with Conan.
Leno is not a victim, he’s a douche.
January 19, 2010 at 12:24 am
Exactly.
A lot of people are taking the approach of “Well, anything Leno says must be true!” and then “Who’s this Conan guy sahdkasdjaskdjas not funny, I don’t need logic, I gots me Leno!”
January 19, 2010 at 12:54 am
PREACH IT, SISTA!
January 18, 2010 at 11:30 pm
For me, these shows aren’t about the host… it’s about the guests. Over time the talk show format has morphed into a narcissistic showboat for these guys and they strain under the burden of being on every night. Of course they’re going to suck on occasion.
The one who sucks the least, percentage wise, will be the winner, no matter what you or I think. The numbers rule. That’s why they need their own separate shows on different networks. Then you or I can enjoy being the underdog when we realize that our own opinion goes against the grain of the rest of the world. And isn’t that what this discussion is about, what CONAN is about? Being a rebel. A nonconformist as they said in the 50’s and 60’s. and that makes our enjoyment of these folks so much better. That’s how stalkers are born!! We need a woman host folks, a modern ‘Carol Burnette’ type of woman…. oh, but then there’s all the wardrobe problems. Forget it.
January 19, 2010 at 1:08 am
I do agree with you that I’d like to see a woman on one of these prominent shows. It’s been a boys club for a long, long while.
I bet you Tina Fey would make an EXCELLENT late night host.
January 19, 2010 at 12:45 am
How long does NBC expect to milk the rapidly aging Jay Leno? Even if he regains “Tonight”, how many more years does the man realistically expect to be working? Letterman AND Leno probably won’t be doing their gigs in 5 to 10 years. Conan would have won the late night war and been a success had he been given the time. He will be around a lot longer than Leno, and if NBC thinks that they’re going to miraculously get Leno’s ratings back to where they were last May, ha. Comedians and entertainers are appalled by this situation and are speaking out publicly against NBC AND Leno. His nice guy reputation is forever tarnished, he will fail miserably. And when NBC realizes this, Conan will be on another network doing his thing and justice to NBC will have been served.
January 19, 2010 at 1:17 am
Yes! This is what I don’t get when I take my Leno-hating shoes off and try on a pair of peacock loafers. I can’t even see how this works from NBC’s point of view. As soon as Leno gets the show back, he’s a ticking time bomb. He’s not going to be around forever. And with the public backlash from his public unveiling of being the villain that he is, he’s not going to be a ratings winner, at least not right out of the gates. (And if he ever is, I’ll have officially waved the white flag on society.)
So where does that leave NBC? 5 year of second place tops and then having to pull up Jimmy Fallon? If that’s what NBC wants, just keep Conan. He’s Jimmy Fallon only actually funny and has a future making money for NBC.
January 19, 2010 at 1:09 am
The sad thing is that even though I personally like Conan and not the Big Chin guy, I do undertand that America is apparently more suited to Jay Leno. Fine. Then you should never have started this succesion saga to begin with. Keep your bland Leno and let the smart-asses like Letterman and Conan try to beat him. This thing of supposedly giving Conan the crown and then immediately knifing him in the back is absolutely Machiavellian.
January 19, 2010 at 1:29 am
Exactly.
One of the things I respect most about Conan is his desire to push comedy. He’s smart and his comedy is smart. Now, I know you can point to Fedex Pope or Masturbating Bear and say that’s “lowest common denominator” humor, but what it is exactly is pushing what a network will allow. That’s what David Letterman always wanted to do on the Tonight Show Johnny Carson wanted him to have.
Conan wants to evolve the art of comedy. He wants to never stop working on the craft. He wants to push the boundaries. Jay Leno, however, devolves more in more to fit what the network thinks is safe and comfortable for the audience. He not only is a backstabber at a personal and professional level, he’s stabbed the back of comedy over and over and over again.
Jay Leno is a boil on the ass of comedy.
January 19, 2010 at 1:19 am
I hope you Leno fans don’t take this the wrong way, but there’s something strange I’ve noticed about you guys everytime I get into a conversation with one of you. For some reason, as amazing as it is, you guys always have a huge pole in your mouths. And by pole, I mean schlong. And by schlong, I mean penis. Listen, I’ve got nothing against gay people, but I just find it STRANGE that every LENO FAN is CONSTANTLY sucking on male genitals. It’s really wierd. I mean, who doesn’t like a good BJ? But seriously, 24/7? After a while that noodle is going to go totally flacid, and yet still you continue to slurp and slobber and generally make a HUGE MESS.
Please give it a rest, Leno fans. And please stop trying to carry on conversations (over the internet or in the real world) with a wanker in your mouth. No one can understand you!!!
January 19, 2010 at 1:33 am
Maybe that’s how Leno viewers survive a torturous hour of Jay Leno’s brand of “comedy”.
Without it the rest of the world would rather take a chainsaw to the face than suffer through Jay Leno’s nightly abortion.
January 19, 2010 at 2:03 am
Your Wrong about Leno needing the money.. IN Magazine interview a year or two ago He stated that he has never spent a dime of what hes made doing the tonight show. It has all come from doing stand up…
January 19, 2010 at 3:17 am
He’s also apparently afraid of leaving showbiz for fear of ending up penniless. Not that I see any reason for him to have that phobia. He’s absolutely loaded. He’ll be dead long before he needs another dime. That’s why he still does his shitty stand up at casinos to fund his car fetish.
He also still does stand up at clubs, collects the door, and uses it as walking around money. He’s a greedy sonofabitch, for sure.
January 19, 2010 at 2:20 am
Just thought I’d add that a longer story from Sept 28, 2004 about the Leno retirement is at
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/28/business/media/28nbc.html?_r=1
This only amplifies the point that Leno was it total agreement to give the Tonight Show to Conan, and points out that Leno signed a contract to that effect 6 MONTHS BEFORE Conan signed his contract.
Leno and NBC are screwing Conan and the viewing public in general
January 19, 2010 at 3:24 am
Just for comparisons sake, I watched Leno’s video about handing over the Tonight Show “dynasty” to Conan on Funny or Die. (Found here: http://tunedin.blogs.time.com/2010/01/18/jay-leno-politician/)
And then I suffered through Leno’s terrible monologue to see the man lie to my face with his –I mean NBC’s clean up — side of the story that he gave tonight on his show.
And of course, Leno’s explanation in contrast to what he said in 2004 was laughable. Even as he was trying to make himself sound like such an good, honest NBC soldier, he was still lying about getting “fired” twice. I was under the impression that quitting your job and retiring wasn’t the same as being fired.
And his whole “if it will keep my people working, I’ll take the show back…I guess…*sigh*” Yes, what a burden for Jay Leno. Getting the show back. What an altruistic saint Jay Leno is.
January 19, 2010 at 2:21 am
All for the Conan supporters obviously have never met him. He is an arrogant Ass, completely full of himself. Rude to his employees and fans. The smart ass you see on TV is his real persona, it’s not an act.
He didn’t take his whole Late Nite staff to LA, he terminated more than 160 of them when he left. He only took part of the band, half of the writers, a couple of producers and a secretary. Every one else is on the unemployment line. A New Start is the way he put it.
At least Leno took his entire show, close to 200 people with him to the new show.
Conan is also being out pointed by Nightline in the 11:30-12:00 slot and Jimmy Kimmel in the 12:00-12:30 time slot. Jimmy Kimmel for Pete’s sake. Not a recipe for a long live show.
Conan will have 30-35 million to play with until his Fox gig starts. A couple of Arsenio type years there and then he will be doing guest shots on the Jimmy Fallon show.
January 19, 2010 at 3:31 am
And still, Jay Leno will be a sycophantic prick. And before long he will be finally dead. And before I piss on his grave, I’ll dance on it.
P.S. Good luck on the Jay Leno Tonight Show getting ratings back now that he’s left NBC prime time a mess and everyone hates him. I give it 2 years before he’ll be out on his ass doing shows in Reno for drunken assholes who get complimentary tickets to his show to be lured to the casinos to spend money and then he’ll get booed to the grave.
And then guess what, his legacy will be that of the guy that not only destroyed the most respected late night show on network TV, he’ll also be thought of as the guy that ruined NBC forever.
January 19, 2010 at 4:07 am
It is very clear Apoplectic Fittz comment #112 that you absolutely have no idea of how to form a thorough idea or be objective. Jay Leno made it inordinately clear tonight that he was approached DIRECTLY, by an NBC executive IN HIS OFFICE and told that “Conan is getting other offers, we don’t think you can sustain your #1 status (which Jay did ANYWAY) and we’re giving Conan “The Tonight Show.” Really, honestly, what part of that don’t you get or do you refuse to get? Just say, “You don’t think Jay Leno is funny.” That would make more sense than the senseless babblesnap bull you’re tossing out there in the face of fact. Do your realize that the billion dollar behemoth that is GE could take Jay Leno down for libel for saying that in front of 5million people if it weren’t true.
It’s this kind of thinking – YOUR kind of thinking that has ruined so much of life period. The “no matter what is said I remain blind of reality in behalf of my cause/position.” Really frustrating to clear thinking people. And this is written by someone who thinks Conan is hilarious – he just doesn’t belong at 11:30 – he’s brilliantly quirky for 12:30 forward.
Sounds like the rumblings of an out-of-work writer, Apoplectic. The cool name that about seven people get. You’re so extremely uncool and you don’t even get it.
January 19, 2010 at 4:18 am
Have you seen this, Blazemun?
http://tunedin.blogs.time.com/2010/01/18/jay-leno-politician/
See how much 5 years has changed Leno’s story? If you only honestly think Leno felt hamstrung enough to just retire for Conan and now say something 5 years ago, you’re delusional.
So, you did watch his “side of the story” tonight, but you fail to see how he says he was concerned about what Conan would say to being bumped to 12:05 by NBC saying “Yes, yes, he’ll do it!” Only he didn’t. What did Jay say then? “Sure, I’ll take it back!”
No one is disputing that NBC bungled this to the highest degree, but for those trying to paint Jay Leno as one of the people innocent and in NBC’s wake, they need to realize the long history Leno has of fucking people over to get what he wants.
I mean, the man said, “Conan, it’s yours.” and then angled until he got it back. Why would I suddenly believe any other word he says no matter how formulaic it is for an easy to see agenda?
January 19, 2010 at 4:58 am
Jay said he’d take it back because he never wanted to leave in the first place. I don’t know where you were then — but I was sitting in my office at NBC when it went down. That’s WHERE I was. Where were you? Jay Leno is one of the only true people in the entire industry. The only guy who comes out to the audience before the show starts WITH NO INTRODUCTION or fanfare of any kind and just talks to the audience. The ONLY guy in recent memory to step up first and pay for his entire staff to keep the show going OUT OF HIS OWN POCKET during the crippling WGA STRIKE OF 2007-2008. I’ve been in this industry for a long time and I know people don’t do the nice gestures above. They just don’t do them. Period. They don’t know how to pull of paying WGA and AFTRA Union fees for 175 people out of their own pocket and ALSO be a chessplaying entertainment job rapist. The two cannot exist in the same body. I KNOW for a fact that you are wrong about Jay Leno. I bet Conan is an outstanding guy. I like ‘em. In fact, I love him. But, he’s falling for the dupe that it’s Leno’s fault. That Leno’s old and he needs to go away. No. Be the baddest on the block and MAKE people go away – AND THEN DELIVER. If Conan had delivered they wouldn’t have asked Leno to return to 11:30 at all. And he couldn’t even LOBBY for it if that’s what you think he did. Which he didn’t. This isn’t about taking turns. If you’re on the air for 16 years following the TONIGHT SHOW – you don’t need 2 years like Leno had. Leno was not on every night — he was the guest host of the Tonight Show. And he turned it up beyond 2 guys who both had the pleasure of being on LATE NIGHT for years and years and years leading up. It’s really a trip to see hateful people snapping on the good guy. I personally know from behind the desk where decisions are made before network shows even get the info that Leno is not a snake or a double dealer. I happen to know first hand. And all your writing is conjecture, speculation and pointing to links you’ve read.
January 19, 2010 at 5:17 am
Hahaha. Is that you, Dick Ebersol? If so, could you tell me whom the song “You’re So Vain” was about? I’ve always wanted to know!
Shouldn’t you be off ruining lives?
The fact that you’re from NBC doesn’t surprise me. Of course you’d stick up for this train wreck. Thanks for clarifying which side of the fence you’re on.
It’s nice to see you toeing the company line about Conan “failing to deliver”. Leno didn’t have Carson’s ratings when he took over in 1992 but guess what, he was given more than seven months, with some all time ratings winners as a lead in. Conan had seven months and one of the worst lead in performers of all time, Jay Leno.
Great work, NBC.
Do you just ignore that he came on the Tonight Show and said “Conan, it’s yours.” Did that just not happen in your mind? If he is such an altruistic saint, why is he reneging? And worse yet, if he didn’t want to go as you and NBC is trying to posit now, why didn’t he speak up then?
I wasn’t there, as you claim you were, so I can only go by what the man said, and what the man said is different from what he is saying now. Regardless of what he did for his staff (which by the way, Conan paid his staff’s salary during the Writer’s Strike, as well), that’s just a flat out lie to say “It’s yours” and then take it back when his show practically sank The Tonight Show.
Speaking of conjecture, do you just willfully ignore the links in the post because they contradict your opinion and that of NBC? Do you just not care about what actually happened?
P.S. Can you get me an autographed picture from Conan before you guys kick him out the door after 20 years of loyalty?
January 19, 2010 at 5:22 am
Couldn’t have said it better. Let’s see if the guy actually comes back and properly defends that, and doesn’t just throw a bunch of insults, or, actually, just runs and hides.
January 19, 2010 at 3:09 pm
I was very clear that I worked there WHEN it went down. I’m not there now. I left. Don’t try to applaud my leaving. I’m not in agreement with everything NBC did or does. Are you cuckoo. Who would be. But, someone already made it very, very clear in a waaaay earlier post AS DID I — that NBC told JAY we’re giving your show to another guy. What part of that are you missing??? If someone walked in and told you “I know you’re doing an incredible job. You’re are our #1 guy, ratings, earner everything. But, we think you’re getting old and cant sustain it.” What would you do? Truly answer that. What would you do if someone said, “We need you to go away even though you’re doing amazing?” Have you ever dealt with that scenario. Now if you tell me some altruistic bullshit like you would ‘keep your word” (a word you were forced into to save face) — you are not being real. Don’t say what needs to be said to keep your blind followers here on the Conan train (even though I think he’s hilarious). Tell me what you would do if someone walked in your office and said “move over.” Then the person failed at YOUR job. And the boss that told you to move asked YOU TO COME BACK. You’re telling me you would say, “But… but I’ve said in the press that I’m retiring.” Hell Jay Z retired, Michael Jordan retired, — but when people love what they do — and they’re #1 at it — why am I having this conversation. You’ve mentioned Leno being dead and stuff. I’ll never be able to even steer you toward making sense of this scenario. You’ve never met anyone in the scenario. Leno, Zucker, Conan – any of them and you wax from your computer. God I’m gonna run from you know. You are completely ridiculous. Wait, I need to check and see if you ever answered the CW ratings post. Dammmit.
January 19, 2010 at 4:26 am
He sure “made it clear”… in 2010, this month, after there was hatred toward him.
But in 2004? No. No one was upset. He was “happy” to retire.
Or even if he was ousted, happy to plot his return takeover.
Look, if something like this happens once, it’s easy to brush away, but if it happens twice, it’s a bit suspicious of the man’s sensibilities.
January 19, 2010 at 3:39 am
Also, dude, Conan brought his entire fucking band and even added a guy that used to be the part time drummer, James Wormsworth, to the full time band. Stop lying to make the situation appeal to your sensibilities.
You know why some of Conan’s crew didn’t come to the Tonight Show? Because Late Night was in NYC and the Tonight Show is in LA. Some people don’t like to move themselves and their families across the country. Jay moved down the block.
Congratulations, man, you’re as deluded as NBC.
January 19, 2010 at 4:27 am
I’ve never, EVER seen a person claim Conan to be an ass, save for you, and maybe some angry execs as of late.
January 19, 2010 at 3:34 am
You forgot to mention that Jay eats babies. Jay and NBC knew what they were doing all along. NBC had to know that Jay was trying to sabotage his 10 o’clock show just to fuck Conan’s lead in. I mean it was pretty obvious.
January 19, 2010 at 3:43 am
And what a convenient time to make this move. Right when late night TV on NBC is on hiatus for the Winter Olympics. It’s the perfect time to just move Jay Leno back to the Tonight Show.
I can’t believe people are blinding themselves to this treachery!
January 19, 2010 at 4:09 am
DUDES!
Oprah has her own!
Why not Conan?
Support it!
Ask for it!
Freaking foul mouthed dudes, get your own network!
Leave us alone.
January 19, 2010 at 4:20 am
Ummmm, well OK. Have a good night. CHILL!
He could have his own C magazine. He could build schools where he wants to. He could convince boys to complete high school and get diplomas to work in the health field and medicine to help their neighborhood. He could convince them to help others as they would want others to help them in time of need!
January 19, 2010 at 4:25 am
Conan’s going to change lives with comedy like Oprah changed lives with book clubs, free cars, and hugs.
January 19, 2010 at 4:25 am
You guys have ALL missed the real issue here… which is the fact that the NBC put Conan up against The Colbert Report @ 1130p and THAT is what ruined everything because Colbert is GOD!!! WOOOOOHOOOOOO! In your face DICK Ebersol!
Come to Comedy Center Conan and together we will rule the Universe!
January 19, 2010 at 4:31 am
Watch out man. Jay might read this and come for Colbert next. It’s his personal mission to destroy anyone funnier than he is. (By which I mean, everyone.)
I mean, Jay’s ratings were already faltering in the past few years due to facing steep competition from comedy shows on cable for the first time and more people using DVR, downloading shows, using Hulu, etc.
If the Tonight Show with Jay Leno flops, as expected, he could be gunning for Comedy Central next!
January 19, 2010 at 4:40 am
Okay, I’m going to expose your dumbass point by point. You are just reaching for straws here. Please, please, please display to me with a LINK to a reputable demo counter THAT
THE JAY LENO SHOW was getting beat by CW Reruns!!! Huh? You are the hypocrite. You are the bullshitter. Not Leno. You said that clearly in your post. But it’s 100% not true. You’re just talking. You’re are really getting on my nerves lashing out with tons of unsubstantiated bullshit. Once again this is being written by a guy who reallly digs Conan. I’m just realizing how over the top, hateful, uninformed you are. You are the classic example of the urban hip-hop worlds moniker: HATER.
January 19, 2010 at 4:52 am
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/43024
There you go, pal.
I’m not just talking. I’m not uniformed. I’m just not burying my head in the sand for an out-dated comedian and his out-dated traditional media conglomerate.
You might not believe, or want to believe, what I’m saying is truth, but the fact that it is actually the truth shouldn’t make you want to alter perception to suit your idea of what actually happened.
I’m sorry if that’s hard for you.
Hate the game AND the player in this case, so say the HATER.
January 19, 2010 at 5:24 am
Leno went 100% against what he factually said. NBC played favorites, as well.
What’s there to discuss?
January 19, 2010 at 4:48 am
Leno looks more grotesque with each passing show. I am hopeful that his karma will soon catch up with his contorted face and he won’t be able to hide it from even his most rabid elderly fans.
January 19, 2010 at 4:55 am
What is NBC going to do as Leno’s geriatric audience continues to die out along with the rise of new media?
Their stable of late night hosts include a watered down Conan rip off artist during his worst years in Jimmy Fallon and Carson Daly. Yuck.
NBC is done in late night for a long, long while.
January 19, 2010 at 4:51 am
EXACTLY!
Why would Conan try to imitate anyone else?
Trash ALL the crap from the past; get new writers equal to himself and go for his own thing!
He knows where he has been; let him go where he needs to go next!
Apoplectic Fittz — Conan incognito?
January 19, 2010 at 5:11 am
Here’s what’s at the end of the link you sent me. Having trouble (even though I worked at the network) seeing how those numbers at up to topping the other numbers. I don’t see the winning you eluded to. Am I missing something? And what is AIN’T IT COOL NEWS. Where’s Nielson? Hollywood Reporter? Variety? Anything reputable.
1.3 (1.1) (1.3) (1.0) (1.2) (1.1) (1.1) (1.1) One Tree Hill
1.3 (1.0) (1.2) (1.1) (1.2) (1.1) (1.2) (1.0) Gossip Girl
1.2 (1.2) (1.3) (1.4) (1.5) (1.5) (1.7) (1.8) The Jay Leno Show
Where do live? Where are you getting your info. I’m gonna have to go ahead and expose you man. You’re talking out your ass. Anyone who can read ratings can see that’s NOT superior numbers.
January 19, 2010 at 5:25 am
The absolute sign of a man without a leg to stand on is that he immediately goes after the source.
Like the people who get upset in an argument when wikipedia is brought up.
January 19, 2010 at 5:32 am
If you’re “in the business” as you claim, and you don’t know what Ain’t It Cool is, I don’t know what to tell you.
January 19, 2010 at 3:01 pm
Just want to thank Blazemun for bringing the stats to my attention. You’re right! Funny how you can read a headline and assume it’s true when, in reality, the statistics show otherwise. Too many of us following the headline hype these days and not getting to the meat of the matter.
C’mon guys AICN is not a factual source for something like this…learn to discern. It’s been said that you can prove anything you want by twisting statistics and sources. I think that’s what is happening on this website.
I’m old enought to remember when Leno was given Tonight over Letterman…I wasn’t too happy but understood it as business. I also remember articles saying Leno was “not” happy about being forced to retire when the agreement was first made—not 2 years later as you have posted here. But, Leno has always been a studio guy it seems. You can admire that or not. It’s a different perspective. Either way, I choose not to read blogs that spread “hate”. Won’t be seeing you…
January 20, 2010 at 3:23 am
All he brought to your attention is his inability to read ratings, apparently. The point stands. Leno’s Show was beaten in the ratings by CW shows. Imagine if Leno had that kind of lead in when he was hosting The Tonight Show.
January 20, 2010 at 3:22 am
You do realize that the numbers in parentheses is for previous weeks, right? The 1.3 number was for CW’s competing shows compared to Jay Leno’s 1.2. So you can see the slide of the Jay Leno show from a 1.8 all the way to beaten by the CW.
I’m not wrong, my friend.
I assumed you could read ratings. Hmm.
January 19, 2010 at 5:15 am
Gonna have to let you slide Apoplectic. I thought I was in for some true mental gymnastics — but now see you’re just waffling on — on the fringes of entertainment. Weighing in — but not WORKING in the industry. Just bloggin’ — not really bringing it at all. Or are you? You can’t even see how someone would want to save face — and claim retirement because they were being publicly humiliated by a network they made bobobillions.
January 19, 2010 at 5:27 am
This is the kind of stodgy, elitist thinking that has gotten NBC into this mess. The ego of it all. The wretched hubris.
At what point in 2004 was Jay Leno being publicly humiliated? Was he so defeated by the bigwigs at NBC that he just wanted out of the game? Even he isn’t saying that’s how it went down in his revision last night.
Look, I’m open to believing, for your sake, that Leno didn’t really want to retire. We can play pretend with each other for a moment. Do you honestly think if he was publicly humiliated that he’d want to stay on 5 years later after he said, on his show, that he was passing the torch?
No matter how it is spun, it doesn’t add up. Jay Leno reneged and there’s really no way to dispute it unless we completely erase everything that’s happened from 2004 until early this month. Unfortunately, even though they’re trying their damnedest, not even NBC can do that.
January 19, 2010 at 5:27 am
I’m sure anyone can see it that way, but that’s just a matter of “Do you believe Leno, or do you not”.
I mean, the way things have played out, it certainly casts a shadow of doubt on whether that man can even be trusted. It’s easy to claim near about anything, after everyone starts hating you, and laying attacks on you, and you want to defend yourself.
January 19, 2010 at 5:28 am
Hey, generation grunge wigger geek metrosexual bohemian loser psycho. Listen up. Coco failed in the ratings. In Hollwyood, failure means the network loses ad revenue and money. Jay was number one in the time slot for a dozen years. What part of ratings failure don’t you understand?
January 19, 2010 at 5:38 am
Jay failed in the ratings just as bad as Conan – for nearly 3 years.
Why does Leno get special treatment?
January 19, 2010 at 5:41 am
How about the one where Jay Leno’s ratings were the worst in prime time in either Jay or Conan’s run at The Tonight Show.
I don’t want to call you a mental midget because I don’t want to get into a name calling match with you. I’m saving up all of my name calling for Jay Leno this year. But, you kind of leave me no choice.
Do you honestly believe the ratings of 7 months, with the help(?) of Jay Leno shitting the bed in prime time, is means for calling Conan’s Tonight Show a failure? If you honestly do believe that. I don’t know what to tell you. That’s asinine.
That Jay Leno guy, the one with “number one in the time slot for a dozen years,” he had similar ratings to Conan for his first few YEARS after he took over for Carson. It takes time. Something Leno decided to renege on.
That’s what I don’t understand. What do you not understand about it?
January 19, 2010 at 5:45 am
and also… Leno failed at 10 PM. Leno failed. LENO FAILED AT 10 PM.
He was rewarded for being a failure.
January 20, 2010 at 9:19 am
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/11/jay-leno-defends-conans-r_n_256910.html
January 19, 2010 at 7:49 am
If Johnny Carson couldn’t stand Leno, there must be a good reason. All we have to do is look at Leno’s devious history to see the why we shouldn’t trust him now.
I’ve never understood his allure- Why would I want someone to uncomfortably over-explain extremely lame and simplistic “jokes” followed by unattractive guitar noises?
January 19, 2010 at 8:13 am
This is kind of where the debate has boiled down to for those who aren’t really invested in this fiasco but want a side to pick. For those on the ancillary of delving deeper in the hows and whys of where we are with this story, taste is all that is measured.
Do they want safe, coddling, mild chuckles, and thoughtless words that bring a dulled smile to their face as they fall asleep to with the television on? Or do they want to laugh?
Do they want smart, original ideas, witty comedy that pushes the limits and tries to develop the art of comedy further? Do they want to be jostled into a fit of laughter?
NBC has screwed this one up so badly that it looks like pushing the envelope will never get it’s fair shake.
Mediocrity wins again.
January 19, 2010 at 8:46 am
Conan sucks. He’s always had the benefit of following the #1 show in late night. Take Leno’s Tonight Show lead in away and Conan couldn’t draw flies. He is unfunny and spends most of his time laughing at his own dorkiness. Ooooh, look at me. I am a cornball. Now I will fake a dorky face. Now watch me do a dorky robot dance. The only thing worse than Conan is Andy.
Conan played this like a moron. He should have stayed at NBC as HOST of the Tonight Show and kept making his $20 million a year. He probably could have got a couple more years tacked on at $25 million a year more. Don’t give me that crap about destroying the show by making it air from 12-1am. It used to be a 90min show airing from 1130-1am back in the day.
With Leno doing a 1130-1200 show, Conan would have seen a ratings bump and actually started making money and NBC could get themselves out of the red.
Jay got the same ratings at 10 o’clock that he got at 11. That was the same ratings he originally was predicted to get. Those ratings (5.7) will get you #1 at 11:30, but last place at 10pm. Conan was getting a 2.8 as host of the Tonight Show. Leno was bring in $25 million a year at NBC. Conan was LOSING NBC $5 million.
Also, Conan should have also more about everyone that works for him. They moved their families across the country for him and Conan put them on the unemployment line.
The bottom line is Conan sucks. Always has. He will never get a job as good or that pays as well as the one he just walked away from.
Conan blew it.
Never.
January 19, 2010 at 9:41 am
Listen, Conan saw the writing on the wall. Moving the Tonight Show back would be a temporary salve and PR curtsy move by NBC. It’s pretty clear that NBC wasn’t committed to the Conan Tonight Show after they shuffled the deck chairs on the Titanic for Leno and it blew up in their face.
In case you missed it, it’s Leno’s show that obliterated NBC’s prime time schedule, developmental prospects for future scripted shows, and provided the worst lead in for the Tonight Show EVER. And yet, he’s getting first billing over Conan in late night? That’s the most blatant and gross example of failing upward that I can remember. The Tonight Show on after Jay Leno, on the next day, isn’t the Tonight Show. It’s Jay Leno’s sloppy seconds.
I’m proud of Conan for sticking up for The Tonight Show with Conan O’Brien. That includes, yes, himself, but also that same staff you refer to. Why should Conan be expected to cave to NBC’s blatant disregard? It took a lot of balls for Conan to just tell NBC to shove their lies and broken promises right up their ass and I respect the man for it.
As much as I selfishly wish Conan would be doing his show every night instead of facing uncertainty, I’m glad he denied NBC the satisfaction of negating their embarrassment for a situation handled worse than any in network history.
By name alone, you’re right, you can’t beat the Tonight Show in terms of prestige if your line of work is performance comedy. Given that Conan worked the last 18 years of his life to reach that pinnacle, only to get stabbed in the back, I’d imagine he recognizes that better than anyone.
But to have a watered down Tonight Show while playing second fiddle to a square peg of failure in a round hole of lies, I can’t blame Conan for telling NBC to fuck themselves for making him bump his show for such an asinine idea.
And you know what? David Letterman was told the same thing when he didn’t get the job at the Tonight Show that Johnny Carson wanted him to have. So what did he do? He went and created his own legacy and STARTED a venerable brand that will live on to compete with the Tonight Show until NBC goes out of business in five years. Letterman went from losing out on the only show that mattered to creating the show that beats the show that, with Jay Leno’s mutiny, doesn’t matter anymore.
Conan can do that too. And I’ll support him wherever he goes.
January 19, 2010 at 9:24 am
Keep trying to make this about Leno’s ratings when The Truth is that it’s about Leno being a liar and a backstabber. Letterman knew the game in ‘92 and refused to buy the bullshit. Conan thought he had Leno and NBC bullshit proofed with the contract but they weasled anyway. The evidence is everywhere and it’s mounting.
Jeff Zucker was on Charlie Rose last night but the interview overlapped into Conan so I didn’t catch the whole thing. What I did see was pretty obvious, it’s hard to hide the dishonest body language.
Rose’s website hasn’t released the video yet, but here’s a short clip.
http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2010/01/jeff_zucker_ive_received_death.html
January 19, 2010 at 9:53 am
I’d like to hand-deliver Jeff Zucker and fistful of death threats.
January 19, 2010 at 1:47 pm
hey man, i love you. look at that, totally reading the comments unlike every other news source on the planet.
January 19, 2010 at 11:29 pm
It’s seriously bizarre how everyone is just overtly ignoring what has transpired and simply taking Jay Leno and NBC’s word at face value.
It’s absurd.
January 19, 2010 at 1:58 pm
The dream show: the week that Leno’s Tonight Show reappears, I’d like to see Dave’s week of shows be as follows:
Each night a roundtable disscussion, led by Letterman (who is hands down the best interviewer in Late Night TV [excluding perhaps Charlie Rose]), with the following guests: Conan, Andy, Bill Maher, Craig Ferguson, Jimmy Kimmel if poss., and CBS’s own Les Moonves. One or two guests should be traded out each night for someone else, perhaps someone related or tangentially related to the Late Night wars (say, Pat Sajak, Bill Carter, or Doc Severinsen).
If Dave can torpedo Leno’s first 2 weeks, he’ll continue to trounce Leno as NBC attempts to pull itself out of the mire.
January 19, 2010 at 11:31 pm
I’d love nothing more than for Conan to make the rounds on all of these late night shows the first week of the new Jay Leno Tonight Show. And then spend a week with Letterman.
That would be glorious.
January 19, 2010 at 4:25 pm
So…you’re basing this entire rant on Leno’s statements about retirement back in 2004? Your shitty point of view, is because you’re looking at this through your ass instead of your eyes.
If the man changes his mind, and decides he doesn’t want to retire, that is his right. You and I change our minds everyday. It’s not Leno’s responsibility to make sure Conan succeeds.
“Leno knows NBC wouldn’t let him go” what the f*ck is he supposed to do? Again, if he decides he wants to work elsewhere, that’s his right. If I say today, “I want to retire” does that me I can never work again? If your answer is yes, then you’re just a dumb f*ck and this comment is pointless.
Quit being so biased and maybe your website wouldn’t suck so much. By the way, if Conan’s ratings are down, NBC has the right to bring Leno back in hopes of raising those ratings. The only bitch move here, is NBC not letting Leno out of his contract…everything else makes sense. You can’t blame Leno for not retiring, whether that was never his intention or not.
By the way…his “ultimate plan” was to quit the Tonight Show, just to go back? What kind of stupid ass “ultimate plan” is that? You’ve got to see how stupid that sounds. Why leave in the first place?
January 19, 2010 at 11:35 pm
You asked your own question in the midst of your poorly worded, hateful little diatribe. “Why leave in the first place?”
Why go on his show and say, “Conan, it’s yours.” if he didn’t really mean it? If you can answer me that, I might pay you some mind. Otherwise, you’re nothing more than a shill for believing Jay Leno when he says anything now that he has been exposed as a back stabber.
January 20, 2010 at 11:39 am
Glad you say that Mr. Fittz…maybe, just maybe NBC is the culprit here. Maybe Leno said what he said to be a “team player”. Point is it makes no sense for Leno to “plan” this for 5+ years. Again, what’s his point?
January 19, 2010 at 4:37 pm
what a load of crap…hey I heard Leno was on the grassy knoll in Dallas in 1964…oh wait, you lamebrains weren’t alive then.
January 19, 2010 at 11:39 pm
That’s really all you want to contribute to this discussion? To be dismissive? If you really want to engage in this, engage, otherwise, continue looking foolish.
It must be strange to just willfully askew facts in a situation to make it tolerable for your ideal. What’s that like?
January 19, 2010 at 5:15 pm
its funny how even in the face of direct quotes with citations, the dumb older people still flock to his side without a hint of actual justification (@bob marley) and leap to insult people for no good reason other than their age…
and @McChaney, if you’re reasoning of Leno changing his mind had even a hint of validity, every contract in hollywood would suddenly be disputed overnight.
and any statements relating to an ultimate plan were used AFTER he hinted at not retiring twice, and the exact comment was used to refer to an article on nov 2 on this year, about a month before all this started, when he brought up going back to the tonight show on his own, without prompting, and years after expressing his own desire to quit, and even signing a contract to the effect… so how is that NOT his plan, executed and carried out every step of the way, and regardless of original intention?
I mean come on.
January 19, 2010 at 11:43 pm
Exactly. I’m so sick and tired of hearing what a grand network solider Jay Leno is when Conan COULD HAVE gone to another network five years ago if he wanted to when his contract was up. Instead, he stuck with NBC under the guise that NBC had a succession plan in mind for him to take over the Tonight Show after Leno decided five more years was enough for him.
So how does Conan get repaid for HIS company loyalty? The biggest, most public act of Hollywood treachery that I can remember.
If it were really so simple as Jay Leno “changing his mind,” the contracts never even needed to be drawn up.
January 19, 2010 at 5:31 pm
Leno didn’t just say he was retiring, he said he wanted to pass the mantle on to Conan because no one deserved it more, and because nobody but Johnny Carson could do the show into his 60s, and because his wife Mavis wanted him to take her out to dinner…and blah blah blah.
If he had an ounce of dignity he would have kept his word and gone out with class the way he said he wanted to, and the way Carson did.
Then there is the fact that this isn’t the first time he and NBC stabbed a successor host in the back. I don’t care if Leno changes his mind about retiring, but what he has done is the lowest of lows and it’s not the first time.
And the Kennedy assasination occurred in 1963, idiot.
January 19, 2010 at 5:39 pm
I am glad someone is calling out Jay Leno for his hypocrisy and conniving nature with evidence. I get the whole it’s all business thing, but the man’s lack of integrity is shocking and disgusting.
Allow me to supplement your exhibits with visuals and words straight from the horse’s (or chin’s) mouth.
Video #1: Leno announces his retirement and proclaims his happiness at being able to pass the torch on to Conan in 2009: http://www.funnyordie.com/topic/leno-hypocrisy
Video #2: Leno’s attempt to pin the blame of the mess on the network while proclaiming his wide-eyed innocence.
http://tv.gawker.com/5451462/as-letterman-hits-back-obrien-calls-nbc-executives-incompetent-morons-and-leno-skirts-blame-conans-show-was-not-doing-well
Video #3: Just for kicks, Leno’s own admission that Conan didn’t get a fair lead-in on the Tavis Smiley show.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/11/jay-leno-defends-conans-r_n_256910.html
January 19, 2010 at 11:50 pm
The evidence just keeps getting more and more damning.
It’s so frustrating watching NBC spinning the situation in a way that so completely goes against everything that has been said for the past six years.
Let those that remember be a beacon of justice. Let us never forget!
January 19, 2010 at 5:57 pm
How does Jay Leno’s sperm taste, bob_marley?
January 20, 2010 at 1:29 am
Clearly, like the typical Conan ass-sniffer oh, sorry, FAN, you are too idiotic to understand that your “evidence” supports the fact that Jay is innocent in all of this, and the only ones who are trying to blame Conan himself, are Conan’s own fans doing their bellyaching best to try to make a larger hero out of Conan. The pure fact that Jay was already shopping for a new network is an absolute indication that he was not happy with his retirement, which was absolutely a story fabricated by NBC to make it sound friendlier to the Jay fans who were not happy that Jay was being replaced, period. But if you feel better jerking off on Jay, well, you will be one of the many that may be getting better sleep at night, and one of those who will always refuse to believe that you never watched Conan and was counted.
January 20, 2010 at 2:22 am
I’m not exactly sure what point you’re trying to make. This paragraph you just wrote doesn’t make any sense.
If you feel like Jay wasn’t happy with his retirement, why didn’t he speak up when he announced he was retiring, when he said: “Conan, it’s yours.”? Why did he force NBC’s hand to do something about him after already making a pact to retire? If Jay Leno wasn’t absolutely certain five years wasn’t going to be enough for him, he should have spoke up instead of allowing NBC to handcuff Conan into a deal they never intended to honor.
Jay Leno sticking around NBC in 2009 is the worst move NBC has ever made for their network and all of it was done because Jay Leno reneged on his word. All of this about Jay Leno’s desire to have the spotlight and not allow anyone else to have it.
I don’t know why I have to repeat this point over and over to the people duped into believing Jay Leno is some kind of victim here. I don’t see how you and others like you can dispute the information within this post and corresponding comments. They’re not my words. They’re the words of the parties involved.
Is it really so hard to read and be informed of what happened, as it happened, and not let a giant corporation sway your opinion? It’s not like I’m just talking out of my ass and cooking up theories, I’m only replaying the words of the parties involved as they happened to show what ACTUALLY happened instead of what we’re being told happened now by a company facing one of the largest PR hits of all time.
I will sleep better at night with the knowledge that I, and many others like me, know the honest truth about how all of this played out. I’ll also sleep like an lamb at the thought of Jay Leno’s betrayal ruining a once respected media titan.
If this is the hand NBC was going to deal Conan, with a stacked deck for Jay Leno, then thank goodness he’s getting off this river boat.
Your captain can go down with it.
January 20, 2010 at 4:38 am
I’m not sure who the writer of this article is, this Epileptic Fit, or whoever, but all I can say is get a life. These are TV shows, nothing but TV shows. All the energy and vigor people are putting into all this trivial doings, if only it were harnessed for something that mattered, like healthcare, or the economy, then maybe we could make things better in the real world, for real people, instead of all this mental masturbating people are doing in the Vast Wasteland.
January 20, 2010 at 5:28 am
If I’m getting the gist of your jab here, spelling my username is difficult for you even though it is written about 200 times on this page and we should get a life from caring about a subject that you yourself have lowered from on high upon your pedestal to discuss with us?
You sound like a winner, josh.
January 20, 2010 at 8:33 am
It was good article, but all the teeth gnashing kind of overshadows the factual content. Let’s face it. NBC & Jay have screwed Conan over and all we can hope for is that A) Conan lands a kickass new gig and B) NBC & Jay slide into the La Brea Tar Pits of History. People are going to get sick of this spectacle, it’s human nature.
January 21, 2010 at 12:26 am
This does bring up a good point. It seems like for a week straight we’ve been reading how NBC is finalizing a deal to oust Conan and will have something to announce “soon.” It seems strange that they’re prolonging their very public undressing.
I do know that some of it seems to be them scrambling to try to perform some damage control with each new article increasingly trying to pin the blame on Conan. But still, if this is the choice they made, you would think they’d want to move on.
Each day that passes NBC just looks worse and worse. And each day that passes is another day that Jay Leno continues to harm his legacy that has been brought to light as a fallacy.
January 20, 2010 at 10:41 am
Has anyone here mentioned that when Leno took over the Tonight Show he did not have Carson Lambasting it from an earlier time slot stealing any potential viewers that he may have garnered from Carson?
NO Carson flat out retired gave Leno all his faithful viewers and did not compete with him and yet somehow Conan still did as well maybe better than what Leno did when he took over.
I don’t watch any Late night show’s I work 3rd shift but it just really seem’s Leno and NBC shoved one right up Conan’s pooper.
January 21, 2010 at 12:31 am
People that don’t want to believe that “American good guy” Jay Leno could be so dastardly seem to think Leno took over the Tonight Show and made it ratings success.
What they fail to realize is it was the original ratings success. It was THE show to watch after the news, like you say. There was NOTHING else. Leno took the show and did about as well as Conan is doing now. He was given time to improve his ratings, however, unlike Conan in this case.
Somehow, the folks that like Leno or want to support NBC for only God knows why, seem to forget these little nuggets of truth.
January 20, 2010 at 12:19 pm
I read an article in this debacle from an insider saying that Jay is almost pathologically afraid of being poor again… which is one reason he changed his mind on retiring… something to do with his “humble beginnings”. Whereas Conan has taken a huge leap of faith, quitting the Tonight Show on principles, honoring the tradition and valuing the establishment the Tonight Show represents… Sacrifing personally to keep from destroying this institution. His leap of faith was so great, he took his 200 staffers with him… and they are the reason why the talks are taking so long… he’s not leaving them out in the cold… he wants a good settlement for them. The comment about it’s his fault they’re unemployed is bullshit… You can’t give a person a choice that goes against their ideals and principles and then criticize them saying its a PR move.
Obviously NBC cares a lot less about The Tonight Show franchise than Conan does himself.
While I have a strong dislike of Fox News, I very much like Fox Entertainment and FX. I would love to see him do a “daily show” like program on Fox. Or he can do his classic show pretty much as is.
The real problem with ratings is that in those shows that appeal to the younger, more internet savvy viewers, a lot of us are watching our favorite shows online because of convenience, scheduling, and instant gratification.
Until networks figure out how to reconcile time slots and internet viewership into one hard number, in a way that is as profitable for online viewing as it is for tv viewing, then what happened to Conan could very well happen to him again.
True, he didn’t have a chance to grow his audience… but a significant portion of his audience was internet based. That’s what screwed him.
January 21, 2010 at 12:34 am
This is a good point. It honestly is laughable that NBC doesn’t take into account things like DVR recordings, internet views, or any number of new media ratings like iTunes episode purchases.
There isn’t just three channels on the dial anymore. It’s time to evolve, NBC.
January 20, 2010 at 12:42 pm
Is Conan even still on the air? I am not sure what was a bigger waste of time- reading this article or watching an episode of Conan. Why not put Conan on during Carson’s time slot. Conan is definitely funny at 2am but not at 11:30pm.
No wonder this writer’s mom is the only regular reader.
January 21, 2010 at 12:38 am
HAHA! You don’t follow the news or major events! HILARIOUS!
January 20, 2010 at 3:46 pm
Let’s not let our bullshit ‘NBC employee’ get away with his other…alterations…to the truth. Leno was the LAST of the talk show hosts to agree to pay his writers during the WGA strike. Letterman was first, Conan second, even though he didn’t own Late Night, like Letterman owned his own show, and Leno…..lagging very far behind. Had to be forced into it like Bush into New Orleans.
January 20, 2010 at 3:51 pm
And to this BULLSHIT notion that Leno had to build his audience from the ground up…..You children don’t remember that the Tonight Show used to be a fucking INSTITUTION in this country. Jay was handed a show that was required night time viewing for most of America. When there were no other late night talk shows to compete against. On only three networks.
Leno screwed Carson. Leno screwed Letterman. Leno screwed Conan.
And I hear when Jay Big Jaw Leno gets cold, he hides his wiener in the butt of an eight year old Laotion boy. It’s true.
January 20, 2010 at 5:30 pm
@Surly Dave, thanks for pointing that out. Many of these Leno fans mistakenly assume that all of us who support Conan are youngsters. The fact is I started watching Johnny Carson as soon as I was allowed to stay up that late. That was 1968.
Johnny never would have let this crap happen on his watch, and that’s one of the reasons the Tonight Show was in institution. That’s also why I support Conan.
Not only that, Letterman would never have let this debacle happen either. Only Leno and his fans are selfish enough to ruin something that is bigger than all of them put together.
Nobody will ever care about the show again because it has the stench of deceipt and duplicity all about it. Good riddance.
January 20, 2010 at 5:54 pm
Correction – when Leno said he’d retire he meant from the Tonight Show not from show business. He kept his word. It’s business guys. Both men understand this. Why is this so personal to all of you? Isn’t there something else more worthy of your indignation? Surely you can galvanize your youthful energy toward doing good someway, somehow? Read today’s headlines. Are you sure that this situation between two extraordinarily wealthy men and well-off staff members is worth your collective energy? They are going to be ok. Are you?
January 21, 2010 at 12:46 am
I’m very sick of this patronizing position. It’s absolutely arrogant to think that caring about something is less or more worth my time than what you care about or that this particular subject is the only thing I might care for.
Leno never said he was retiring from showbiz –lord knows we couldn’t ever be that lucky– but he did say “Conan, it’s yours.” about the Tonight Show. It’s not just about business. (And if we concede that it ultimately is and nothing anyone said, or the contracts they sign matter above the almighty dollar in NBC’s pocket, read through these comments and you’ll see why this isn’t the best of moves financially for NBC, either.) that It’s about honor. It’s about a man’s word, of which Leno’s means nothing, apparently.
I will be ok. I am worried, however, about the people that don’t consider a large scale, public betrayal, like this one, a problem.
January 20, 2010 at 6:48 pm
All this over a damn TV show. Who cares? The “Big 3″ have sucked for a long time (exception: Lost). And Fox isn’t much better. So boo hoo, Conan!
January 21, 2010 at 1:02 am
Your opinion on this matter seems to be about as valid as if you stumbled off the street drunk into a PTA meeting and told the auditorium that you like to touch children.
January 20, 2010 at 9:06 pm
Leno?? I say fuck him in his big ole chin slit!(Several times)and please don’t use no lube. Thanks for the memories ya mook!!
January 21, 2010 at 1:14 am
NBC can Zuck off. FREE CONAN!
January 21, 2010 at 1:16 am
Love the Bugatti dressed as a rat. So much subtext, that is directed right at Leno, and it is expensive. You know that Leno worships autos, so this is directly aimed at him, the rat that he is. And the Beatles song, he’s right, will be expensive and will cost NBC money in perpetuity to play that clip on the internet. Every time someone watches it. (distant evil laugh).
January 21, 2010 at 2:27 am
hell yeah! replay it on hulu, I am with you my brother.
January 21, 2010 at 9:20 am
Leno is a prick, he stole the Tonight show even though Carson wanted Letterman, then his ratigs blew (until Hugh Grant came on) and NBC offered the show to Letterman who declined. Coco never had a chance once Big chin who drives many cars decided he wanted his old show back since his 10 pm show was tanking
January 21, 2010 at 4:46 pm
Jay Leno is Gumby, dammit. He *is* show business.
January 21, 2010 at 8:15 pm
Haven’t you heard? Gumby is dead.
January 28, 2010 at 12:13 pm
> Haven’t you heard? Gumby is dead.
So? Leno has been dead for at least 10 years.
January 21, 2010 at 6:52 pm
Dude, I kind of love you!
January 21, 2010 at 6:54 pm
I didn’t think anyone hated Leno more than me. Well, except Dave. And Conan.
January 21, 2010 at 8:47 pm
GO CONANDO!
January 22, 2010 at 2:12 am
I’M WITH COCO
January 22, 2010 at 6:49 pm
BOYCOTT NBC
January 22, 2010 at 6:50 pm
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=268718638146
Sorry, here is the link
January 23, 2010 at 2:33 am
boycott nbc!
January 24, 2010 at 3:36 am
I’m curious – had Conan taken the offer to move his show to 12:05, do you guys think he would have gotten his 11:35 time slot back once Leno did eventually retire?
I also wonder what other options NBC considered when it became clear that Leno didn’t want to retire. Did they consider moving Conan to 10pm? Did they consider right off the bat shortening Leno’s show to a half hour and moving Conan to 12:05? I mean, this IS still a half-hour improvement compared to where Conan was at. I think NBC would have been a lot better off if they left Leno at 11:35 and tried to deal with Conan instead, even if it meant paying him off. Then they could still have given Conan the Tonight Show when the day came that Leno did retire.
Now because of NBC’s mismanagement of this situation, Leno’s image has been tarnished and Conan has been screwed. Way to go NBC, negatively impacting the careers of BOTH of your Late Night hosts.
January 27, 2010 at 2:01 pm
No, Michael, I don’t. I think NBC would have allowed Conan to finish his contract and kicked him to the curb.
January 28, 2010 at 12:21 pm
Boycott NBC. Ok! Wait … I think I’m already boycotting NBC. I can’t think of anything I watch on it. I can’t even remember the last thing I watched on NBC. Yeah … I think it was some show called “Dateline” where this incisive reporter kind of guy creates criminals by hooking them up with underage prostitutes (that is, prostitutes for NBC) and filming their hilariously surprised reactions. Kind of like Candid Camera, except not as good, and Candid Camera was on CBS. And they probably didn’t even intentionally plan the pun “Dateline.”
February 3, 2010 at 12:23 am
nbc sucks, the only show I am even remotely interested in is Chuck, the rest of them can suck it! I am so mad they pushed conan out. Zucker and whats his dick-face ebersol will leave a legacy of failure behind once they finally leave the network. Zucker was holing a grudge from some college joke from Conan. Obviously zucker has no sense of humor, good luck keeping your sorry pos network afloat. I laughed so hard when I saw ebersol on the colbert report smooching up to him asking to come on their olympic coverage while colbert made jokes to his face about how their network is in the dumps.
February 19, 2010 at 1:38 am
When I first heard about this I couldn’t believe it. Conan is just about a million times funnier than Leno, and that’s a fact. No, not just an opinion. It’s like saying The Beatles are better than Vanilla Ice, or that cheesecake is better than fruitcake. It’s just true. Anyone who ever gave Late Night with Conan a chance knows this. Conan has to have a much bigger and faster growing fan base than Leno, especially after this.
And not only is Conan funnier, he has integrity. Although I’ve never met him, this shows not only through his career decisions, but through his comedy. I can’t think of many performers that are/were so in-tune with their audience and fanbase. He knows what people like, what his strengths are, and sticks to his guns while always pushing his own boundaries. Even if he’s a jerk (which I doubt), no one can deny that.
As for Leno, I don’t think anyone could say the same about him. The best that I’ve ever heard from his fans is a mild approval.
I’m not worried about Conan- he’s the man. And I’m sure he’s very well off. But it’s the principle. The PRINCIPLE.
I particularly like Leno Eats It’s post #122…hilarious
Long Live ConeZone!
February 19, 2010 at 1:43 am
Correction- #124
July 13, 2010 at 10:37 pm
The creators and writers of this site are lying pieces of shit spreading mistruths and lies.
Assholes.
July 13, 2010 at 10:39 pm
Prove me wrong.